How We Role with Robert Peterpaul

Join us as we dive into the world of acting with Robert Peterpaul, an award-winning actor, writer, and host of the podcasts "The Art of Kindness" and "How We Roll." In this episode, Robert shares his journey from childhood acting to Broadway, and offers insights into managing an acting career like a business. Discover the importance of authenticity, networking, and maintaining a strong online presence.

Key Takeaways:

The significance of treating your acting career as a business. How to effectively use IMDB and casting sites as marketing tools. The role of kindness and authenticity in building industry relationships. Tips for maintaining a balanced and fulfilling career in acting.

Guest Information:

Robert Peterpaul: Award-winning actor, writer, and podcast host. Podcasts: "The Art of Kindness" and "How We Roll."

Connect with Robert:

Instagram: @robpeterpaul TikTok: @RobertPeterPaul

Call to Action: Tune in to Robert's podcasts for more insights and connect with him on social media to join his kindness community.

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction to Robert Peterpaul
• 3:19 Robert's Journey as an Actor
• 7:51 The Birth of His Podcasts
• 9:25 The Art of Kindness Podcast
• 12:05 How We Roll Podcast
• 18:36 Navigating the Industry: IMDB and Branding
• 25:59 Finding Your Essence as an Actor
• 28:37 Crafting an Authentic Casting Profile
• 36:04 Networking with Purpose
• 42:24 Leveraging Social Media for Authenticity
• 47:48 The Importance of Giving Back
• 49:27 Navigating the Business of Acting
• 51:32 The Importance of Human Connections
• 57:37 The Art of Self-Taping
• 1:04:41 Final Thoughts and Kindness in the Industry

Transcript

David John Clark (00:00)
Good morning, everyone. It's good morning for me in Adelaide, Australia. And we're coming from just outside of New York, United States, where I think it's about 5pm yesterday. Today, my guest is Robert Peterpaul. Robert is an award winning actor, writer, interviewer and host of two podcasts, The Art of Kindness and How We Roll. And How We Roll is how I found Robert and why we're chatting to him today. He's been in Broadway shows, TV, film and has interviewed actors,

casting directors, agents, and many in between. But beyond the spotlight, Robert has a deep understanding of how actors can run their careers like a business. And that's what we're focusing today. Welcome, Robert. Thank you for joining us today.

Robert Peterpaul (00:40)
Thank you for that lovely introduction, David, and thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here.

David John Clark (00:45)
Thank you. It's an awesome pleasure to talk to other actors and people in the industry, but it's also another pleasure to talk to fellow podcasters. And you're so good at it that you have two podcasts.

Robert Peterpaul (00:58)
You are too kind. I love to be a pod of it, if you will, David. Is it true, first of all, is it true that we are recording right now on different days? That's wild to me that it's.

David John Clark (01:02)
Ha ha.

Yes. So it

is Thursday morning here in Australia and your Wednesday night. Is that correct? I know I love it. I always like to joke that I have the lotto numbers for you if you wish. So I've done that. I've done that so many times, but no one shared any winnings with me. I don't understand what's going on there. Thank you. I love it. You're too late. You committed. Firstly.

Robert Peterpaul (01:12)
That's so cool. Yeah. Hello.

Well, please send them to me because I do with. Hello, people to future.

⁓ I'll share with you. Wait, is this being recorded? Because if that's recorded, maybe I won't say that. No, I'm just kidding. Okay, you got it. You got it.

David John Clark (01:37)
I've listened to pretty much every episode of your podcast, How We Roll. So I'd like to thank you for that. It's an insightful journey for myself as an actor and a major reason for having on the show, as I said before, but I must admit The Art Of Kindness slipped through my net, but it's now in my queue. It's ready to binge. So I'm looking forward to checking that out.

Robert Peterpaul (01:53)
Oh! Thank

you. Well, first of all, thank you for supporting How We Roll. That really means a lot to me because the impetus for it was getting DMs from other actors asking me questions. I don't see myself as an authority figure. I always say, take what I say with a grain of salt. But I have the privilege of speaking with so many leaders in this industry who are worthy of giving advice. And so it kind of came from that. I was getting all these questions and I thought,

wouldn't it be wonderful if we just had a space built for this? And so every time I hear an actor listens to it and get something out of it, it just fills my heart with joy because that's what it's for. You're my people and I want us to all have as much information as we can on this wild yellow brick road we're running down. And I'm glad Art of Kindness is now on your queue as well because that has equally been a fulfilling journey in its own right.

David John Clark (02:34)
Mm.

Thank you. Excellent. Can you give us a quick insight into firstly, your journey as an actor that has led to where you are today? And then a quick intro into the two podcasts and how they became part of your everyday acting regime, so to speak.

Robert Peterpaul (03:06)
Sure, yeah, know, David, my parents say that I came out of the womb singing and dancing and making weird Jim Carrey faces and, you know, that I kind of, I made a face for everybody listening at home. I'm gonna be making a lot of weird faces, probably spoiler alert, throughout this conversation. But I don't really remember a time when I felt like I wasn't wanting to be an actor. I think I did struggle for a while with

calling myself an actor and I think it's exciting today we're gonna talk about the business end of things because I think that was the culprit once the business entered this dream of mine. But you know, I started at a young age, I was a child actor. I used to, you know, make my friends put on little plays in the basement. My dad hung up a curtain in our basement with drawstrings and I would play Broadway Overture soundtracks and open and close the curtains

to an audience of stuffed animals. And I just thought it was so dramatic to have the curtain open and close. And then when friends would come over, I would rope them into doing shows with this weird curtain that was very dusty and I think like a strange green color, probably from the 50s or something, my Dad found it at a garage sale, I don't know. But I would then make movies as time went on and I could, got my hands on a camera. And so I was always creating and wanting to act. And I had the good fortune of then

booking a tour and then an off-Broadway show as a child. And that's when I started to see the business end of things, which was unique. And so I think as I got older, the dream became paired more so with pressure and some stress and wanting, I don't know if anybody out there can relate to this, but wanting to do quote unquote the right thing or go down the right path. And so I didn't fully own that that's what I wanted to be for a bit, like in my college days.

⁓ But then after college, I hit the ground running and I've been acting ever since on stage, screen, and I've been fortunate to kind of run the gamut there. And I am under the weather, everyone, so if my answers don't make sense, you can blame the cold medication, okay? Just gonna say that off the bat here.

David John Clark (05:23)
It's still that COVID thing. I can't believe we still talk about COVID, but it is out there. mean, it's just another form of the flu really that we've got to move on. It's no big thing anymore. Hey, you said you went to college. So it was college acting college as well. You've gone and done a course. So you've had that decision down the bat.

Robert Peterpaul (05:26)
Yeah, it feels so vintage.

Yeah, forget it. I'm fine.

Yeah, you I settled on going to a school that wasn't strictly for the arts. You know, I could have done that. And I went to Marist College, which is a liberal arts college, but they have majors of all shapes and sizes. And I sort of loved that because I wasn't just around our beautiful special people that we call artists. I sort of saw everybody following different paths in this life. I did study theater and English and radio, television, film. It was a kind of a unique combination that I made.

And yeah, I mean, I loved it. That's where I met some of the best friends that I still have today. And I think that's really important in this business to try and find your community, find your people, find the ones who will read a self tape with you last minute at 10 PM before you have to hand it in. And yes, it was a wonderful experience that I'm grateful for. and that's where I met my wife. I should probably have led with that, David. I probably should have said that first.

David John Clark (06:39)
No, I love it. I love it. How many years have you been married?

Robert Peterpaul (06:43)
Well, we've been together over 11 years, but we've been married for almost three. It'll be three in November.

David John Clark (06:49)
Oh wow, wonderful, wonderful. My wife and I, I think we've just hit 26 years. So thank you. I'm old. We're old.

Robert Peterpaul (06:51)
Yeah.

⁓ congratulations. That's,

well, listen, you'll always be older than me just because you live in the future. You know, you're a day ahead, so.

David John Clark (07:06)
I love that. How did you come up with your podcasts? So you've got the two of them. Obviously they didn't start concurrently, did they?

Robert Peterpaul (07:14)
No, The Art Of Kindness was my first foray into podcasting. I have always been a huge fan of podcasts, but I never thought I could make one, you know? I dabbled in radio as a kid. I took a class and I remember I burned my own little radio show. It was basically me announcing songs onto a cassette and I recently found that cassette and it kind of brought back the memory of how special it was just to hear myself on a tape. And then of course now I'm like, I hate my voice, I can't listen to it.

David John Clark (07:24)
you

Robert Peterpaul (07:42)
Which makes for really painful editing sessions, I will say. But The Art Of Kindness started during the pandemic. I thought if I was gonna be in this industry as a creator, because I love to write, I love to act, I kind of like to wear many different hats, then I kind of want a day job in the industry. I always thought it made sense to have my day job be in the business. So I was making connections and sort of, you know, having doors open maybe a little bit sooner and...

my way in was actually through like sort of the media circuit. So I've always worked as a writer for different entertainment magazines and news shows. And because of that, I built up some publicist connections and I promise this is my circuitous way of answering your question. And so during the pandemic, I was working as an editor for an entertainment news magazine. And I mean, I think like most of us, I was really dismayed at just the onslaught of negative news, you know?

David John Clark (08:40)
Oh yeah!

Robert Peterpaul (08:41)
Not only

was the world going to crap in a Mrs. Doubtfire's handbag, but it was sort of really sad to see how that reflected across genres and businesses, if you will. And the celebrity news circuit was equally as dismal. It was all about clap backs and people getting canceled and obviously some rightfully so. But I was just craving something positive and there's something called AB testing. So,

David John Clark (08:54)
Mm-hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (09:10)
on any new site you go to, they'll probably show you versus your wife or your friend a different headline and they'll see which does better and then they'll start to display that one to everybody, which gets the most clicks. And through that, I started to see, although my headlines would be changed from other people to be more negative, I started to see people were also clicking the opposite, really positive headlines, like baby photos, royal wedding photos, all this stuff.

David John Clark (09:32)
Ah!

Robert Peterpaul (09:36)
And I was like, I know people are craving this as well. And all this in my head kind of jumbled together. And the next morning after I kind of had been really thinking about this, I woke up and The Art Of Kindness just kind of had like sprung into my head and I hit the ground running. I was like, I'm starting a podcast. And for personal reasons, kindness has always been very important to me and my family. And so that was my first foray into podcasting. I think I'm someone who believes in just doing and that's how

David John Clark (09:49)
I love it.

Robert Peterpaul (10:03)
I learned the best. And so, you know, if you listen to my first episode, it probably sounds like I'm in a wind tunnel and I wouldn't listen to it. Yeah, you know, right? Like when you first start podcasting, there's a learning curve, but it's been such a beautiful journey. And I just love the fact that I can now sort of be that person in someone's ear when they're on a walk or they're lonely or they're going for a drive, because I know so many podcasts have been that for me.

David John Clark (10:10)
I think they're all the same. Everyone's the same.

I love it. I love it. And it's funny how you talk about the, the, how we progress from episode one to, wherever you are today. Now, I must say now we are a podcast, we are for listeners, but I do put it on YouTube. So for those looking or watching on YouTube, your background is just fantastic. I love it.

Robert Peterpaul (10:39)
Yeah.

Well, howdy ho.

Oh, thank you. Sorry, again, this is COVID face. This is the new setup that I have. So I try and do different backgrounds for Art of Kindness and How We Roll. This is kind of How We Roll since it's industry. And then I kept this out, but I usually put this out for my other one. This is a poster that I may have stolen when I was at the Tony Awards. Don't tell anybody. So thank you for the compliment, because I recently rejiggered things and yeah.

David John Clark (11:00)
Okay.

Nice.

I love it. Oh,

because this is the first episode in my new house. So everyone that's, thank you. So everyone's watching will know that I've got a different background. So I've got some of my acting books in the background. That's as far as I got, unfortunately, I've got a new light. So it's starting to get a little bit better, but I was, I want to do the poster thing that you've got in the background and a bit of light coming up from the background. So hopefully the next couple of episodes, it'll start to take shape. So.

Robert Peterpaul (11:20)
⁓ congratulations.

Yeah, well, I

like your neutral background. I like the mic. can see we also just moved into a new house. So this is the first week that I have this. Thank you. Yeah.

David John Clark (11:46)
Congratulations to you.

Awesome, awesome. And then just quickly going on to How We Roll, which is how I connected with you. When did you put that together and why was that a bit of a difference? Because your other podcast is still talking to people in industry anyway, aren't you? So you've obviously come in with a different focus.

Robert Peterpaul (12:08)
Yeah, so The Art Of Kindness is, I like to say, kind of built on unhinged positivity at the core. It's very positive without being preachy. And we talk to people who are using their platforms to build a kinder world. And How We Roll is just for actors. So it's all about getting tangible advice that answers those big hows that we all have. And like I said, I've always been a writer. So I was writing for

different casting publications and theater outlets like Backstage, I wrote for Stage Milk, which I think is actually out of, closer to your neck of the woods, and then Casting Networks.

David John Clark (12:48)
I've done lots with StageMilk. They're one of my favorite training

regimes. So yes, brilliant. It's nice to hear. I know you mentioned it somewhere. I remember you saying it or mentioning it somewhere and I'm like, oh my God, we've made it to America. So that's great. Cause StageMilk is out of Brisbane, Australia. So that's wonderful.

Robert Peterpaul (12:54)
Nice, yes I love-

Yeah, no, I love it. I love Andrew over there and I haven't written something for them in a bit, but I was writing for a lot of different sites and eventually it was probably during the pandemic again as well when it was such a dark time, but I think it definitely, like a phoenix, had a lot of people create new things and find new paths. And so I started creating actor reels.

David John Clark (13:27)
Mm.

Robert Peterpaul (13:32)
I was never someone who wanted to really put myself out there by making videos of myself or even sharing clips of my performances. But of course, as the industry has evolved, social media is not going away, we see, or it might implode soon, but it's necessary for now. And so I started making reels that I just thought were like kind of funny and relatable to actors and sort of made me feel less alone and entertained me. And through that,

David John Clark (13:44)
Hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (13:57)
Casting Networks asked me to start making videos and then I started getting a lot of DMs from their users asking me things like, where did you get your backdrop? What's your self-tape setup? How do you format a resume? How do you get your headshots done in a professional manner? And so I started getting all these hows and I went to Casting Networks and I said, I think there's a podcast here. Like I would love if we could just speak directly to everybody and sort of demystify things and give

people a free resource in this time when, you know, casting sites are a little controversial, right? Because it's sort of like, we're in this business of trying to follow our dreams and yet we have to spend money on all these different things just to try and achieve them. And so I really appreciated that Casting Networks heard me out and then we developed this podcast together. took a while and we just premiered this year and it's been such a wonderful journey. And every time I'm meeting with a guest,

David John Clark (14:33)
Yes.

Robert Peterpaul (14:54)
I'm not only grateful, but I always come back to one thing. How can I try and get something tangible? Like I really, I want the episodes to feel inspirational, but I really want the advice that we're getting from people to be things that us actors can do to take action, right? Because we're actors. Action is kind of in the word. We want to take an act and run with it. So I'm hoping it's doing that for people. And I'm again, just very thankful that folks like yourself have been tuning in.

David John Clark (15:24)
Excellent. And it is that because I listen to probably, to over 20 different podcasts, but mostly acting related, but some in the podcast industry and also a bit alien and UFO related podcasts. that's a, that's a whole, yeah, there's another hour for us. So,

Robert Peterpaul (15:38)
⁓ let's go down that rabbit hole.

David John Clark (15:44)
A lot of people, a lot of the podcasts, especially the big production ones where they talk to the big stars and everything, we won't name any names. It's all about me, me, me. And the person just talks about themselves. And what I like about How We Roll and how I do my podcast as well, as well, it's about not about your guest per se, but them talking about what they know and what they've learned and giving something back. And so that, like you said, someone

Robert Peterpaul (15:50)
Yeah.

Hmm.

Mmm.

David John Clark (16:12)
so that people listeners can take tangible information away. And that's what I do as well. And that's what we're here today for. So, you.

Robert Peterpaul (16:17)
Yeah. And you're very good at it, David. I will say I've been listening

to your show as well. And I appreciate that you sort of like get right to the meat of it. And that's something I've learned in podcasting too. It's like, nobody really wants to hear you do a 10 minute intro by yourself, just sort of rambling. They want you to kind of get to the guest, get into the subject. And you of course want to honor the guest and make them feel special. But it's been interesting with Casting Networks and even my other show because

some of the folks that you think would get the most downloads actually don't. And it's like the more specific niche ones that are really talking about something, again, tangible, seem to connect with people. That's been really cool as well. And we've definitely focused more on industry guests this season. So I'm glad you're enjoying it. Thank you.

David John Clark (16:57)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, it's, it's been wonderful. Thank

you. And the problem with podcasts is that they are, it is a medium where people listen while they're out walking or exercising. So as podcasts hosts, we don't get a lot of feedback from your listeners, because it's not like watching YouTube where you can like, and then put a comment or anything like that. So it's very difficult on our side. If you, if you agree that you think you're putting all this out there into the ether and you don't get a lot of information back, but it is nice to know when you do hear

from someone like me responding to you say, Hey, I've listened to every episode and I love it. That's really cool when that happens, isn't it?

Robert Peterpaul (17:41)
Yeah, everybody listening right now, send David a kind DM and tell him that you're enjoying the show, okay? Hit pause, send a little message and then come back. We'll wait for you, I promise.

David John Clark (17:51)
I love that. I'll snip that out and put that in as a separate thing. So let's move into the nitty-gritty here, Robert. You've worked on both sides of the industry as an actor in productions for Netflix, Amazon, and Broadway, and as a writer and editor for major outlets, as you've been talking about. You've seen firsthand how a strong online presence can influence opportunities. So let's start with IMDB. A lot of actors treat it like a static resume, but you know, it can be much more than that, surely. So...

Robert Peterpaul (17:54)
Okay.

David John Clark (18:18)
How can Actors proactively manage and optimize their IMDB profile so it works as a genuine marketing tool for their career?

Robert Peterpaul (18:26)
I think IMDB, okay, first of all, IMDB is such a special tool.

because they have now announced IMDB Pro in the last few years, or maybe it was around before then and I just didn't realize. And you can actually make an account, not that I'm saying you should pay for something else, but if you are able to, you can make an account, share it with a friend. And it's such an invaluable resource because you can find contact information for basically everyone in this industry. And so I would say number one, don't sleep on that.

David John Clark (18:44)
It's always the way!

Robert Peterpaul (18:56)
We are a people first industry. So as many connections as you can make, I think, A, the more friends you'll just have, the more people you'll know in this business, and B, the more doors they might be able to open for you. So I would say, you know, look at IMDB Pro as something you can use to actually connect with other folks in this industry. If you want to pick your dream list of agents and find the contact info on there, that's a great place to start.

If you really look up to an actor who you feel like has done projects you would love to do, you can find their kind of contact info on there and just reach out and ask to buy somebody a cup of coffee and pick their brain. My sort of rule of thumb is never to ask someone for something the first time you're meeting them or even the first couple of times. I'm actually really bad at that. I would rather just get to know someone as a person and I don't want to make people feel weird.

I would say reach out to someone and just connect with them and talk to them. So I do think it's a great community builder, but you know, to get into using it as an actor, the nitty gritty of it, it's sort of the number one place. I feel like people check to see how do I put this? Not like if you're an actor, but it just sort of validates you more than these other sites. IMDB is very well regarded.

And so I would say don't sleep on it in the sense of also having your contact info on there, making sure all your photos are up to date, making sure all your roles are up to date. If you do a small role in a production, they're not always going to remember to add you to the production. So add yourself, make sure you submit that credit, get that credit. And they're unleashing like new features every day on there. It's hard to keep up, but definitely stay on top of that. And, you know,

David John Clark (20:40)
Exactly.

Robert Peterpaul (20:54)
mix around your featured photos, sort of think about, really be intentional. And I've, is something I've been wrestling with recently is being intentional about what story you're putting out there about yourself. How do you sort of want people to see you? Do you want people to see you more for comedy? Okay, well, if I go to your IMDB and your pictures, are you crying in a scene with no makeup on? I might not think of you for that right away, you know? So I would say just really be intentional with

your IMDB profile as well as your other casting profiles.

David John Clark (21:28)
So yeah, you're saying to focus on that branding now as actors, I'll do anything, I'll do anything. But if you know you're good at comedy, yes, you can do some drama and that, but if you really stand out in comedy, then to have that as a, as a brand, so to speak. I mean, some people say you don't need to brand yourself, but if you have that as your focus, so like you said, when someone opens up IMDB they see that, you know, rather than the crying sort of scene.

Robert Peterpaul (21:34)
I know.

Yeah,

show and show your versatility. You know, my agent said something to me recently that really stuck with me, which was get on the train that pulls into the station. And so just because we want to do everything as actors, it doesn't mean it doesn't mean that starting with one thing is pigeonholing ourselves, if that makes sense. So if you're being called in a lot for comedy, but all you want to do is dramas, you know,

David John Clark (21:57)
I love it.

Mm.

Robert Peterpaul (22:25)
you're being given opportunities to work. And the way you approach a comedy can also be similar to a drama. You sometimes comedic characters are actually in more pain than dramatic characters, quote unquote, on paper. So just try and get on the train that's pulling into the station. And then maybe from there, you can work your way up. You can go into different train cars. Eventually, you'll be the conductor and you could steer it wherever you want to go. But I think there's something to be said for, following the opportunities that are

David John Clark (22:35)
Yes.

Robert Peterpaul (22:53)
being given to you versus not to keep speaking in metaphors, but constantly pulling up to red lights.

David John Clark (23:00)
I love everything you've just said there. It makes perfect sense. I've just identified through I've I trained with Greg Apps, who's our casting director here in Australia. And I've done it the second time now I've done his creating compelling characters course, trying to identify your branding or your background. And we've sort of come up with that. I really stand out in the every man character. You know, so that, you know, the he's not the hero, but he's not the loser, but he's the guy that sort of

Robert Peterpaul (23:14)
⁓ cool.

Mmm.

David John Clark (23:28)
everyone sort of goes identifies in them that a little bit that they're, there's a bit of me in that and they want him to do good, but sort of doesn't. But I put that to my agent. I said, this is what we have identified. He says, it's great that we've identified that, but I'm putting you up for everything. Yeah. So it is about knowing where your niche is and knowing where your brand is and applying it to everything, so to speak. And then when you get to the point in your acting career that you're offer only and you don't have to do any more auditions then

Robert Peterpaul (23:37)
Yeah.

Yeah.

David John Clark (23:56)
you go with the flow and choose what you want.

Robert Peterpaul (23:58)
Yeah, you're

gonna get there. Everybody listening, we're gonna get there. Do you have sort of a log line for yourself? Did he talk to you about sort of like distilling who you are in a sentence? I've heard a lot of people talk about this.

David John Clark (24:10)
I have heard that and it's probably one of those things that as soon as someone mentions it, you go, my God, I keep forgetting to do that. No, I don't have a log line for myself yet. Do you have one?

Robert Peterpaul (24:18)
I think it's okay. No, I think that's okay.

Only because I talked about it with someone recently and I don't even remember what it is off the top of my head. It's something like, I think I call myself popcorn in human form.

David John Clark (24:30)
Popcorn in human form, I love that, I love that.

Robert Peterpaul (24:31)
A little

bit buttery, probably too fluffy, you know. But I think what you said is so great because finding out who you are is, I think, the number one step in this business. And then doing it on purpose, as Dolly Parton says, praise Dolly, because casting and directors, they want to see your essence and let it shine through the role. So just because you're sort of labeling yourself now and the word label so tricky, but

David John Clark (24:35)
Ha ha ha.

Hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (25:01)
putting that every man on yourself, it doesn't mean the every man couldn't be a police officer. The every man couldn't be a serial killer. The every man couldn't be a Dad You know, I think we get stuck sometimes on these things being our only character type. And so I love that your agent said, well, I'm still going to submit you for everything because you can let your unique self shine through every role. And there's no reason why in another life I wasn't wearing a police uniform, you know?

David John Clark (25:08)
Exactly.

Mm.

Robert Peterpaul (25:31)
And when you think about the most interesting performances you've seen on TV or on stage, usually it's because somebody that's just fascinating to watch that you wouldn't have pegged as being a certain profession or living in a certain world is in that world. And that's why we like to watch it. I mean, we don't want to see stereotypes on stage, essentially. So, yeah, I think it's super important not to pigeonhole yourself with the projects you can do.

David John Clark (25:54)
Yes.

Robert Peterpaul (26:01)
But it's a nice entry point to sort of give yourself that connection in regards to, I hate the word type two, but it's, know, people we see, if that makes sense. Your brand, I guess, that can also rub people the wrong way, but I think you all know where I'm going.

David John Clark (26:11)
Yeah.

No,

it gives you somewhere to land if you've got nowhere to land, so to speak, it gives you a direction. We've touched on this a little bit, I really wanted to go into this. So you have partnered with Casting Networks through your podcast, How We Roll, giving actors practical advice on all things acting, which is what we're trying to squeeze into one hour today. But when it comes to casting websites in general, and we did touch on this a little bit with the IMDB sort of approach as well, what really makes someone's

Robert Peterpaul (26:24)
Yeah, a landing pad. I like that.

you

David John Clark (26:48)
profile pop out to a casting team when they're being looked up.

Robert Peterpaul (26:53)
You know, one of the number one things folks have said to me that I've interviewed and just in workshops and different settings is honesty.

David John Clark (27:03)
I have heard that and every time they say it you go, yes, honesty.

Robert Peterpaul (27:07)
Yeah, it sounds obvious,

but honesty. And I'm not talking about, okay, maybe you fudged a role, maybe you were the understudy in a smaller production and you said you were actually the part. I'm not talking about that kind of honest. I'm talking about being honest about your photos. Are your photos an authentic representation of you? Being honest about your height, being honest about your special skills because...

I know we all think, okay, I'll just learn it when I get the part. And listen, sometimes that works. It works when it works. But the casting folks I've talked to actually get very annoyed when you're not authentically representing yourself in that way. So I would say just be honest about who you are and don't get yourself in a situation that's going to be stressful. And then, I mean, the number one thing aesthetically people see when they go to your profile, we did a whole episode on casting profiles actually on How We Roll.

And the number one thing I believe we talked about was headshots. And so sort of making sure that you're also very intentional when you're getting your headshots taken. This isn't something I thought about when I first started. Actually, when I first started, my mom was kind enough to gift me a headshot session. And she was like, all the actors get their eyebrows waxed. You got to get your eyebrows threaded. And I was like,

David John Clark (28:23)
Ha

Robert Peterpaul (28:26)
And so she kind of bullied me into getting that done. And it was pretty frightening, David. And so no one will see those headshots ever. But when you're going into a headshot session, you can think about exactly what we were just saying, David, which is, OK, I've distilled that I have this everyman essence. How can I tell that story through different looks and in different photos? And then once you get your photos, ask other people for the ones they love the most.

I know we all see actor friends post their photos and they're like, you know what to do, pick your favorites, but we're not accurate judges of ourselves. So the photos that I'm gonna pick aren't really necessarily the most interesting ones. They're probably deep down the ones where I think I don't look the most like a Muppet, which I love being a Muppet, but let's be real. So I think authenticity in everything, including your photos, which I believe is the number one thing people are gonna see when they go to your profile.

David John Clark (29:11)
Ha

Definitely. And, and it's also about, I suppose keeping these profiles live, so to speak, isn't it? We tend to, and again, it comes down to the business side of acting. We didn't get into this business to run a business, but we have to stay on top of that.

Robert Peterpaul (29:30)
Yes.

Yeah, know, something I keep meaning to do that I will be real with y'all. I don't know if I've done it, but I want to set a reminder on my phone for every six months just to check my profiles. I think if every six months we're holding ourselves accountable to make sure, and you might do it beforehand, but to make sure you have time carved out to actually go to your profiles, update all the roles, you know, you might even want to take some of your roles off if you feel like they're not representing the path you want to

go down anymore. Someone told me once about a resume. A resume should show us the journey you want to go on, and it should show the story of the career you want. And so if you've played a role that you feel like isn't going to serve that, take it off. But every six months, I feel like is a good time to refresh everything. You don't have to get new headshots every six months. Oh my goodness, we'd all be living on the street.

David John Clark (30:11)
Mm.

Yeah.

No.

Robert Peterpaul (30:35)
Try and keep things as up to date as possible because you're working hard and people should see that.

David John Clark (30:42)
I think the problem being is that I'm sure that it's the same for you in the States and anywhere in the UK, here, Europe is that there are now a myriad of casting sites that you've got to choose. Casting Networks is my high profile one. That's the one that's used mostly here in Australia, but there are other ones as well. And they're all pretty much the same, but they don't sync.

to each other, so you've got to update them all. And you really probably need to keep them all about the same, don't you? So you need to go through each one and keep them up to date.

Robert Peterpaul (31:05)
I know.

Yeah,

I know it is so frustrating. You're like, I also have a website. Can you just look at that? But that's one thing I appreciate about Casting Networks is that it offers a lot of free resources in addition to the service. And they actually unroll a lot of really cool features. So what I learned about recently is that on the Casting Networks profile on your resume, if you have a clip of you playing tech guy number one on a TV show, you can actually

embed it on your resume. So when a casting director is on your resume, can play the role right there. So there are a lot of different features on different casting sites to take advantage of. And I think within that six months reminder, just remind yourself to check every single one, update all of them. Because like you said, not only are they separate in regards to having to update them, but they all sort of offer different things.

David John Clark (31:40)
Yes.

Robert Peterpaul (32:04)
Access and Backstage offer different things than Casting Networks. Casting Networks sort of has a lot of different projects. Backstage is more theater. So depending on where you're focusing, I think you should put your energy there as well.

David John Clark (32:09)
Mm.

And you don't know what's happening in that back end of things. You don't know when a casting director is looking because it doesn't, you don't get in there and get a printout of ⁓ everyone that's been to your site. So you don't know what's happening. You don't know when they're looking. So if it's not up to date or you're not using it, then you might be missing opportunities because they go in there and say, ⁓ this person hasn't done anything for five years. Whereas you have, you just haven't updated your site. So you might be missing out on something. ⁓

Robert Peterpaul (32:33)
Yeah.

Exactly,

yeah, that's a really good point.

David John Clark (32:48)
Awesome. And so just moving on a little bit. I want to talk about how do we get on the right radar? So you've spent time, interviewing big names for The Art Of Kindness and, How We Roll and on red carpets at the Tony awards, for example. So you understand the value of building relationships without overstepping or I like to say like, you don't want to be seen as a stalker. So for actors wanting to

Robert Peterpaul (33:06)
Hmm.

No. Unless you're playing one on

TV, I guess.

David John Clark (33:13)
Exactly. For actors wanting to connect with casting directors in a professional way, what do you think is a smart and realistic approach?

Robert Peterpaul (33:21)
You know, it's so funny you asked this question because I was just working on our next episode for How We Roll, which is gonna be all about this, authentically networking and connecting with people. And I think what I've learned over the years and in talking with different people is that it's actually becoming more important now in this current world to work with people that you enjoy versus people that maybe quote unquote are more talented or

David John Clark (33:28)
Wonderful.

Robert Peterpaul (33:50)
to work on a project that might be busier. If you look at Adam Sandler, I mean, he picks sort of a vacation destination, brings all his friends and then films the movie, you know? I think that's kind of telling exactly and just has a great time. And I think with the world and a lot of the darkness that's here, we all just want to be around good people and people that we feel like support us and we're going to have a good time with. So I would say before you do any networking or reaching out to someone,

David John Clark (34:00)
and then makes a million dollars. Beautiful.

Robert Peterpaul (34:21)
this sounds so simple, but put yourself in their perspective, in their shoes. If you got this email out of the blue, or if you had this person come up to you out of the blue at an event and they said what you're about to say, how would you feel? So just take a moment to think about it, first of all. Second of all, I've had to learn this so much over the years. It's that old phrase, have you heard, you know, don't book the job, book the room? I'm guessing you've heard people say that. And that's...

David John Clark (34:46)
Yes.

Robert Peterpaul (34:50)
something I've really latched onto because it actually has taken pressure off auditions for me. It's sort of like, go in there, be yourself, and sort of look to connect with someone else behind the table or behind the virtual camera. And it's just more authentic than, know, people can smell sort of the desperation of you wanting something from someone. And I go to, I actually don't go to a lot of networking events. I go to events.

David John Clark (35:06)
Mmm.

Robert Peterpaul (35:19)
Networking the word kind of scares me. I prefer to just think of it as like having fun at a place.

David John Clark (35:25)
Yeah, I've

talked about networking before because I come from a public service background and networking for me has always been a negative connotation because networking in a public service environment that I've grown up with and is my real career till I retire in a couple of years has always been about knowing the right person and, and weaving your way in. You might not deserve it, but you're in the right network.

Robert Peterpaul (35:34)
Yeah.

David John Clark (35:50)
And I've, I've, I've always had that negative connotation on the word. So I do like to change that a little bit and, and I haven't come quite come up with the right word for acting, but you're right. It's about mingling with the right people for the, for the right reasons.

Robert Peterpaul (35:50)
Yeah.

Yeah, the right reasons and sort of just building connections, like human connection. If you think a bit about it as relationship building and if you're in a scene with someone, you're seen partner, it's like you want to connect with them. So it's authentic. And I think going in there, wanting something from someone automatically shuts the gate, cuts that off a bit. I work in a lot of nonprofit spaces as well. And it's sort of that feeling of, you know.

David John Clark (36:08)
Hmm. Relationships.

Robert Peterpaul (36:32)
We want to connect with you, but we also want your money so we can keep working on this nonprofit. And I think it just comes down to treating everybody like you would treat a good friend and leading with kindness. I'm a huge proponent on being kind to everybody, not because they can give you something, but because it's going to make the world a better place. And there's actually science behind it that it does come back to you as well. So if you can lead with kindness, I think

David John Clark (36:50)
Mmm.

Robert Peterpaul (37:01)
to give a tangible tip, because you know, I also love, that's the buzzword, take a shot everybody. I would say, give people authentic compliments. That's a nice way and I find if I'm feeling awkward at an event or if I don't know what to say to somebody, there's always something nice you can say. So if you love someone, sure, tell them. you know, let's say you do really wanna talk to that casting director or that actor, just,

David John Clark (37:13)
Hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (37:30)
You can go up to them when you feel like you're not bothering them and tell them you enjoyed them in X movie and then kind of walk away without sort of monopolizing their time. That said, if you're at a specific event for networking, when people are prepared to connect with you, then still be authentic, but you can be slightly more on the nose about it. ⁓ I'll never forget I was at one event

David John Clark (37:54)
Mm.

Robert Peterpaul (37:57)
where a friend of mine actually printed their headshot and a QR code onto mini pickle juice bottles, I think. I forget what it was. But essentially, it was like, take a shot on me, and then handed them out. And the thing is, if something feels authentic and organic to you, it's not going to work on everybody, but it's going to work on the people that are your people and that you're meant to connect with. And so if

David John Clark (38:08)
Nice!

Robert Peterpaul (38:25)
you feel like doing that sort of thing is fun and represents you, the people that receive that are going to be of the same mindset. And those are the people you want to be your agent or represent you anyway. So being sort of fake and aggressive about it, it's just going to lead you down a path where you're probably not meeting the people you're meant to meet anyway. So be as much yourself as you can in these scenarios.

Again, find what works for you. You don't have to go to big events. You can do the route of, I wanna try and buy someone a cup of coffee and talk to them. Okay, that makes me nervous. I'll just talk to them on the phone. Like find out what really works for you and then let it rip.

David John Clark (38:59)
Yes.

And that sort of crosses over into my next question because we were talking a lot about shaping the room. So we don't get into the rooms a lot anymore because we do self tapes and everything like that. We don't go out to a lot of the industry events anymore because ⁓ of COVID or we just don't want to anymore. It's such a big world or you can't get to everything. So you've built a personal brand that blends your acting work, your writing and your kindness driven mission.

Robert Peterpaul (39:26)
Yeah.

David John Clark (39:33)
Social media is a huge piece of that for yourself and for many actors, but it can be tricky. So how should actors approach their online presence? So it becomes a career asset rather than a distraction.

Robert Peterpaul (39:46)
You're so kind, David. I don't know, tell me. I think this is something we do talk about a lot on the podcast. And again, I think it comes back to authenticity. I think I view social media more as a quote unquote work tool, but I still want to be as much of myself on there as I can. Actually, my day job,

David John Clark (39:52)
Hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (40:09)
has always also been in the social media world. I think it's sort of like short form storytelling, which is super fun. And so I cut my teeth on that working for America's Got Talent, which is a reality competition show. And it was cool because I would work with a 90 year old ballroom dancer and try and get her signed up on Instagram. And then I'd work with, you know, a children's choir and try and get them set. And it would be all about distilling them into like a little brand as we're talking about

David John Clark (40:12)
Yes.

Nice.

Robert Peterpaul (40:38)
before the show aired. So they would have a presence. And if they made it long on the show, they lasted a while. We could help them engage with fans and build a fan base. And what I learned there to seeing the accounts that really thrive now, it's all about finding what works for you and what resonates with people and just doing it over and over again. And I call it kind of the Marvel movie rule.

David John Clark (40:39)
Wow.

Robert Peterpaul (41:07)
Every Marvel movie is essentially giving fans the same thing. They keep tuning in to Marvel movies and want to live in the cinematic universe because it is giving them that same feeling. It's a brand. One of the top Instagram accounts, I believe, is National Geographic, oddly. And I looked at it, and every post is just a beautiful landscape photo of some scenic place and a snarky caption.

David John Clark (41:20)
Yes.

Robert Peterpaul (41:36)
It's the same thing every time. It's sort of like how we break down a scene, right? Like, what is this scene? It's two podcasters talking. Like, if you can distill it into a sentence, two actors talking. So try and think about that for you. Like, what do you want to put out on social media? Try things out, test things. If you don't want to be on there for work, that's OK. You can post really interesting. Everybody, think, has a niche.

David John Clark (41:36)
Nice.

Robert Peterpaul (42:04)
You can post interesting photos of whatever. I would just say make sure it's authentic to you because some casting directors look at follower count's. Some don't care. Some look at your social media and see, ⁓ you, you know, we're at this event. You know this person and they love it. Some it might rub them the wrong way and say, they're trying to be somebody they're not. So as long as you are happy with what you're putting out there, again, I think the right people will find it and

I think the best part of social media is that it is social. And so don't sleep on the fact that you can use it to connect with your fellow actors, to connect with different creatives. I have actually heard of people that have booked Broadway shows because they ended up DMing the director. And they said, hey, I sent my self tape in. I was already in for this show. Is it OK if I send the same tape?

David John Clark (42:37)
Mm.

Hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (42:59)
I really think I'm great for this role. And then next thing you know, the director's like, my gosh, I'm to make sure we get yours out of the pile. And then they booked the Broadway show. So again, be authentic about it. But I think it has its pros and its cons. I'll just say one more thing, and then I'll stop rambling. Don't get caught up in the comparison game, because that can be the thief of joy, as they say. And

David John Clark (43:10)
Nice.

Definitely.

Robert Peterpaul (43:26)
If you're going on there and you're seeing, this person's in this show, this person just booked this and that, and you're starting to feel either jealous or just bad about yourself, just know at the end of the day, it's what we've been talking about. It's curated. It's not quote unquote real. It's just everyone's putting their best versions of themselves authentically, hopefully, out there. And so if it doesn't make you feel good, you don't have to follow

everybody in our industry. You can follow like funny accounts, whatever, but don't let it derail you. You know, is, is like, thank you for coming to my Ted talk, David.

David John Clark (43:54)
Exactly.

And that's an interesting point.

I love it. love it. No, but it's an interesting concept, ⁓ a discussion point, because you don't know what someone's done to get to where they are. Now, I remember a story from Peter Dinklage. Someone turned around to him in a discussion and they said, that's all right for you. You're getting all these big jobs and you're making millions of dollars. Everything comes easy to you. And he went off and he says, I spent 20 years in this industry.

Robert Peterpaul (44:14)
Yeah. ⁓

Mm.

David John Clark (44:30)
Eating peanut butter sandwiches and living off friends' lounge rooms because I couldn't get work and I kept pushing and pushing. Yes, I'm doing great now, but it took me 20 years. So don't judge me on where I am now. Judge me on what my journey was. And that's what I do in my podcast. It's about showing my journey and talking to people about their journeys because you see that one snippet on social media and you don't see the journey, do you? You just see that one moment in time.

Robert Peterpaul (44:32)
yeah.

Hmm.

Yeah, you're so right. And that's something you do nicely on social media, too. It's like you have this great podcast that fulfills you and is a different route than acting. It's sort of acting adjacent, but it empowers you. And you're able to use clips from this very show to post on social media and share with other people and inspire them. And I think that's another point as well. If if you can give something in this industry. Do it.

David John Clark (45:11)
⁓ Thank you.

Robert Peterpaul (45:26)
It's such a take industry in a lot of ways. And because of that, people are guarded and they can sense that. And so be a giver. Be a giver on social media. Give someone a great piece of advice. Give someone a compliment. Give someone a connection, a friend. And I just think it'll give back to you.

David John Clark (45:32)
Hmm.

Yeah. And if you don't expect it, it does come back. And I've done that from day one. I put the podcast together because I wanted to share things that I learnt, especially things that made my journey difficult. So I thought if I can share my learnings from these, then someone's journey might be a bit faster and a bit easier. And I've had people say, why don't you put a course together? I said, well, I don't have the time to do anything more, but I didn't want to

Robert Peterpaul (45:51)
Yeah.

Yeah.

David John Clark (46:13)
take money from people and say, hey, for $29.95, you can get David Clark's acting course and learn the thing. I'd rather do what I'm doing now and share and then people can take the information, whether they like it or whether they want it and go from there. That, and that segues nicely into playing the long game. You've been working in this industry since your Broadway debut,

Robert Peterpaul (46:18)
Yeah.

Yeah, I think that's wonderful.

David John Clark (46:37)
you've navigated theater, film, television and media. So from that long term perspective, what business habits help actors stay visible and consistent year after year? And I say that, you know, in a drudgingly sort of way because sometimes that's how it feels, doesn't it?

Robert Peterpaul (46:53)
I know. Yeah, it does feel that way sometimes. I'll say, you know, I booked a Broadway show when I was little and that was my first business lesson because I ended up in a rehearsal room and I didn't quite understand why it wasn't a stage. And then I never actually got to do the show because it closed. I was a replacement in Seussical and it ended up closing prematurely. And so that was a really big lesson.

in the fact of this being a business driven by people's investments and people's money. And so while I try not to get too caught up in that, I do think about that fairly often in regards to sort of quote unquote the long game. I think, you know, if you're a writer, if you're an actor, remember people are investing an immense amount of money and time into every single project. And so,

it has to be worthwhile in the sense of that you're professional, you're prepared. I think kindness again is the ultimate long game. There's research actually that shows the nice guy doesn't finish last, David. Actually, sharks do get faster results, but kindness in the long game will breed better results.

I can tell you actually a long game-ish story if you want, if you'll indulge me. I think this will be better than me rambling. So, talk about wanting my day job to always be in the industry. I was doing social media for a group of producers, a wonderful group, Resonate Entertainment. Shout out, they're awesome. They've done such amazing work in this industry and they really focus on amplifying female stories and voices. And...

David John Clark (48:19)
I will.

Robert Peterpaul (48:41)
The group of producers, they're pretty iconic. mean, together they've done movies like Home Alone, all the Nancy Meyers movies like The Parent Trap and all these incredible IPs. And so if I had met them maybe years prior and I had just taken like some kind of business class, I might've gone in there actor first, very much in their face about it. But because I had sort of done the work to shed that and thought, okay, these are just cool people. I didn't even think about doing that.

And for years, I think they knew I was an actor, but I didn't really talk to them about it. I didn't talk to them about being a writer, all this stuff. And so years go by and I meet them in person for the first time, because they were in LA, I was in New York, and I worked for Women in Entertainment, which is an awesome nonprofit. We were doing our annual summit. They came. Immediately in person, we just had the best vibe, such good energy and chemistry. And they were like...

you you shouldn't be shy. If you ever want to audition for any of our projects, let us know. And I was like, are you kidding me? And flash forward, not long after I ended up booking a tiny role in one of their films that's now on Amazon. And I share that because, I mean, I had to audition for it, but that essentially came just because I connected with people on a human level. And so

David John Clark (49:52)
us.

Hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (50:06)
all those years of just being friendly with them. I mean, I'm making it sound so businessy now, like it was a plan. It really wasn't. Kind of where the long game. And so I think, again, if you could just approach everything from a human POV and not rush to try and get something from somebody, that's going to work out for you in the long game. Definitely stay on top of your quote unquote connections. I used to send out like a little newsletter

David John Clark (50:21)
Hmm.

Nice. ⁓

Robert Peterpaul (50:35)
to anybody involved in the industry, just to be like, this

is me, here's what I'm doing, like I did this, something silly. Social media is a great way to keep active. But as far as, I don't know, making it through this crazy business, I think the key is persistence and belief in yourself. It starts with you. We're not really in the age where someone's gonna pluck you out off the street.

And be like, ⁓ hey, and give you a part in A Star is Born.

David John Clark (51:06)
It does happen,

it does happen, but it's very rare, isn't it?

Robert Peterpaul (51:10)
It does.

Well, now it's so oversaturated with self tapes and social media that there's essentially kind of more opportunities for that very thing. It happens on TikTok. But I just mean you can't really wait around. You sort of have to actively chase your dream. And part of chasing your dreams some weeks, some months might be sleeping and.

going out with friends and experiencing new things and not auditioning and not thinking about the industry. Because it's such a personal thing and you have to refuel yourself. So find what kind of like gives you life, what enlightens you, enlivens you, enlarges you. Is there any EN word I can add in here? And stick to that because at the end of the day, you have to have that self-belief. And it's a struggle for everybody. It's easier said than done, but that's the long game.

David John Clark (51:42)
Definitely.

You

Robert Peterpaul (52:03)
I think David.

David John Clark (52:04)
I love it. And that sort of summarises everything that we're talking about, both the business side of, ⁓ no, but I love it. It's the business side of acting and the acting. We get into it for the acting, but you've got to find that balance in everything. And you need to be waking up every day, ready to go. But if you find yourself...

Robert Peterpaul (52:09)
The long answer for the long game.

you

Yeah.

David John Clark (52:24)
waking up and you're tired and the drudgery of it, then that's when you need to make a determination to slow down or just take a break or to do something different for a little while, but have that balance.

Robert Peterpaul (52:34)
Yeah. And what do you think too about, I don't know how to say this without sounding too woo woo, but the child version of yourself? I mean, I think a lot about this because we learned so much about the business of acting that sometimes, at least for me, it can cloud the reason we're actually in this, which is to play pretend and follow our dreams and be an actor and do what we love. And so what helps me sometimes is just like getting back in touch with that playful side and

David John Clark (52:48)
Mm-hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (53:04)
sort of like the childlike dreamer in all of us. I know it sounds very woo woo, but that has to always be present too. Like you can't sort of put a suit on it, throw a heavy briefcase on top and crush that little kid because then, you can't, it's just a fine line. You can't get too caught up in the quote on branding and all this other stuff. Cause then, you know, you'll lose the craft. And so yeah, that helps me a little bit.

David John Clark (53:13)
Definitely.

Mm-hmm.

You become too serious. And

I think you've talked about it a lot in your show and I've heard from it a lot that the role that people get is the one they didn't think they were going to get. So they've gone in and done their self-tape or the audition, going, I don't know why they've asked me for this. This is not me. So they've just gone in and had fun with it. They don't care. And then they've booked it. Whereas on the other side of the flip coin,

Robert Peterpaul (53:50)
Yeah.

David John Clark (53:52)
the role they really wanted, that this is me, this is going to change my career. They've gone in there so focused, they didn't get it. So it shows that, yeah, that playfulness. It's going into the room or doing your self tape. Forget about all the business. Forget about how long you've been doing it. Forget about the journey you're on. This is what you were doing. This is what you are. You're an actor. Get in there, act, have fun, hit stop at the end of the record, send it in and go and do whatever.

Robert Peterpaul (54:10)
Hmm.

Yeah, keep it simple, keep it easy. Because when you were, running through a castle and fighting a dragon as a kid on the playground, it was real for you. You weren't spending hours thinking of a backstory of the night. You just kind of did it and do what works for you. What makes you feel empowered. And I just heard this advice from somebody in regards to self tapes, a wonderful casting director, Shaheen Baig, who did Adolescents, which was a fantastic watch on Netflix, if you haven't seen it.

David John Clark (54:31)
Exactly.

I have. It scared me because I'm going, if I was an actor on that show, I'd just be crapping my pants. ⁓ they did a great job. Thank you. Yes.

Robert Peterpaul (54:53)
⁓ my goodness, no, you would rock it. Because it's all one long take. It's like a play.

And I just spoke with her that episode's going to come out soon. And she said, she was so kind about it. She sort of was like, just keep it easy. We just want to see who you are. We want it to be natural. And if you're filming a self tape, spend no more time on it than you would if you were coming into our room.

David John Clark (55:18)
That's what I always say. None of this 20 takes stuff. You can't do that in the room.

Robert Peterpaul (55:22)
Yeah,

no, you're just gonna drive yourself cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. I have a rule now where I'm like, I cap myself off at five or I try to depending on the audition. And some days I don't, some days I'm like, I'm just doing two and I'm done. But if you drive yourself too crazy, it's gonna feel fake, too polished. There's something to be said for that magic of just reading it for the first couple of times and...

David John Clark (55:51)
and making it work. I love that. That's my philosophy as well with self tapes. One or two, get it done. I don't have time anyway. My wife's usually reading for me I really get embarrassed when I'm in front of my wife thinking, because you know, you don't believe in yourself. So when I've got my wife reading, I think, oh, she's going to be laughing. She doesn't, she knows I'm wonderful. But I get, let's get it done. Beautiful submitted. So no.

Robert Peterpaul (55:52)
knowing it but not knowing it.

⁓

Hahaha

Is she an actor? No.

David John Clark (56:20)
No, not at all. So ⁓ loves TV and film as much as I do, but would not get it. She's done a bit of, she's done some filming with me when we do the 48 hour film challenge, which she hates, but she's been very good at it when we have. So. ⁓

Robert Peterpaul (56:25)
Yeah. I can relate to that.

That's so funny.

Yeah, I often have to record with my wife. I get to record with my wife and we've gotten into a better flow and she does have a performance background, but I can really relate to feeling sort of that embarrassment. I think it's because it's the person that knows us the best. And so deep down we're like, they're going to know if I'm being fake here. And they're not judging us at the end of the day. It's just our own crap in our brain, but I get that.

David John Clark (56:44)
Nice.

Exactly.

Exactly.

And I love that as we find as we wind up, that's about your supporters. So your wife, my wife, it's great to have someone there that does believe in you and they support you all the way because it's very, very tough industry. And I always talk about the ups and downs, the ebbs and flows of it. Sometimes the mental health aspects of it can be very hard when you get all these no's all the time. So you need that backbone, someone supporting you through and through.

Robert Peterpaul (57:25)
Yeah, it's true. And then, you know, I always come back to it only takes one yes. You know, you're you're one no away from a yes.

David John Clark (57:31)
It can change overnight.

I love that. All right, Robert, this has been fantastic as expected. And to wrap it all up, I hope you're okay with this. But you play a little game at the end of most of your episodes of How We Roll. And I thought it would be great to turn the tables on to you. So here we go with your very own casting keywords if you're okay with it. And we knew I needed I needed the theme song or the theme of music that you put in but da da da da.

Robert Peterpaul (57:47)
⁓ okay.

No. ⁓ okay. I'm excited.

I love it. Casting key works! Yes.

David John Clark (58:01)
That's all you love it. You do it every time. So now you know how it works.

But for those that don't, I'm going to throw you some key words or phrases from the acting world and you fire back with a quick sentence or two in response. Are you ready, Robert Peterpaul?

Robert Peterpaul (58:17)
You know, my currently COVID infested brain is ready and whatever comes out, comes out. Okay.

David John Clark (58:23)
All right, here we go.

Typecasting.

Robert Peterpaul (58:27)
I hate it.

David John Clark (58:30)
Love it. Headshot red flags.

Robert Peterpaul (58:33)
⁓ too much retouching or black and white these days. Although I feel like that trend might come back and ⁓ deer in headlight eyes, not telling a story. Yeah, which we all fall into that pit, but tell a story.

David John Clark (58:47)
Love it. I love it. Yeah,

and you could tell a story from a photo. That's the biggest thing. And that's very, very hard to do.

Robert Peterpaul (58:55)
Yes, and also don't let your clothes be the star. You wear the clothes, don't let them wear you in your headshot.

David John Clark (59:02)
Love it. Weirdest direction.

Robert Peterpaul (59:06)
⁓ like from an actor or a casting director.

David John Clark (59:09)
Well, that you've given or that you've received.

Robert Peterpaul (59:12)
⁓ okay. I one time was auditioning for a commercial for Trident Gum, and they brought us in in a group of about five people, which was automatically embarrassing because we had to audition in front of each other. And it was for a commercial of Trident Gum that was going to air during Rocky Horror Live on Fox. Sorry, maybe I'm calling out too much information. And during the audition, they had us dance and then they had us pretend to chew gum. Didn't even give us gum. And there was one point where they shouted, chew bigger.

And that was wild. And I did slightly break my jaw, but I thought I chewed pretty big. ⁓ Yeah, that was a wild direction, chew bigger. But a good direction that I got, and this is when I come back to all the time and I just need to shout this out, is do nothing. So on the opposite end, a director once told me, just be still. You don't have to do anything. And sometimes that's when the most interesting things come up.

David John Clark (59:49)
Nailed it. Nailed it.

Love it.

course.

love that. I love that. And the last one must do's or don'ts.

Robert Peterpaul (1:00:15)
Must-do's or don'ts as an actor or just like in general.

David John Clark (1:00:19)
Yeah, this is your game.

Robert Peterpaul (1:00:21)
This is my, gosh, must do's or don'ts. Have dessert every night, that's a do. If we're gonna talk general, no, must do's or don'ts as an actor. Okay, must do's, I would say get yourself into a class. If you've never taken an acting class, I think that's a great do because it's inspiring, it's informative, and also it just makes you feel more grounded in this industry. And I know for me, it makes me feel more valid as a performer.

Must don'ts, I will say.

Don't put your worth into bookings. Don't value yourself as an actor or not call yourself an actor just because you haven't booked a role in a certain amount of time. You are an actor. Do something every day that makes you feel like an actor and nobody can take that away from you.

David John Clark (1:01:17)
Love it. I love that. And going on a little bit with that, a lot of people say they add the word just. I was just in or I was just an extra. Gotta drop the just because we're not just, we are.

Robert Peterpaul (1:01:19)
Love that game.

Yes,

we are. I love that. And no, there's no trying, there's only doing, some people say.

David John Clark (1:01:36)
I like that too. And finally, Robert, this is my key final question. ⁓ What is your t-shirt quote? Something that resonates with you and that you'd be proud to wear on a shirt in public.

Robert Peterpaul (1:01:41)
⁓

My goodness. Okay. Obviously I love talking, so I have two. Front and back. ⁓ that's good. Okay. We'll say the front is be kind because it's simple. I think we should all try our best to be kind and kindness. It's complicated. Can't always do it perfectly, but aim for kindness. And the back, I will say is live in the grey. I try to live in the grey. I think...

David John Clark (1:01:56)
You go front and back.

Robert Peterpaul (1:02:21)
Nothing's black and white. And if we could all meet in the middle a bit more, in the grey, feel like the world would be a little bit more peaceful.

David John Clark (1:02:30)
I like that because that, especially with what's happening in the world and we don't want to get into politics, but if, if our leaders and if around the world could do just that, you're right. It would be a different world, a better world.

Robert Peterpaul (1:02:44)
Yeah, yeah, I'm about to fly over there to Australia and get my t-shirt made and stay with y'all ⁓ because we could use a lot more kindness right now, I think.

David John Clark (1:02:51)
Awesome.

Most definitely, most definitely. Awesome. Thank you very much, Robert. Now, before we do finish up, is there anything that we haven't talked about that you you think we need to bring up quickly as we wind up?

Robert Peterpaul (1:02:57)
Yeah.

⁓ thanks for asking. No, this was such a lovely conversation. I hope that my, again, sick COVID-ridden self made sense. Okay, good. Well, that's nice. And I will say, you know, if you're an actor out there listening, I would love to connect with you. If you have questions, that's the point of How We Roll, the acting podcast I'm producing. We want to answer the biggest questions that actors have. So please send them my way. And I know...

David John Clark (1:03:14)
Couldn't tell. Couldn't tell.

Mm-hmm.

Robert Peterpaul (1:03:34)
David can also get them answered on this show as well. And I will just say, good on you for tuning in, because if you're tuning into this podcast, it means that you're working on your career and yourself. And so after this episode, you deserve a treat. Treat yourself to a cookie. And yeah, be kind to yourself.

David John Clark (1:03:37)
Definitely.

I love that. I love that. Awesome. Robert, where can people find

you? What's the best places to find you and your podcast or anything you're doing in the industry?

Robert Peterpaul (1:04:00)
At the bottom of an Nutella jar, David, I will always be there or a pint of ice cream. You can find me on social media at robpeterpaul. I'm on TikTok, being weird, at Robert Peterpaul. Our podcast, How We Roll and the Art of Kindness is streaming wherever you listen to podcasts. You can tune in. And yeah, I would love for you to be a part of our little kindness community.

David John Clark (1:04:23)
Yeah, community. I love it. And I'll put all the links and everything in the show notes. So Robert, this has been absolutely wonderful. Thank you very much. As I said, at the start of the podcast, it's so wonderful when I get to talk to people that I listen to in my ears every day and to bring them into my journey. And that's what my podcast is about. It's about talking to people that are part of my journey. And that's not just other actors or directors or casting directors that I meet on my journey, but it's about the people that I learn from and that I...

Robert Peterpaul (1:04:27)
thank you.

⁓

David John Clark (1:04:53)
take information from and that's in your now part of that journey. Thank you very much.

Robert Peterpaul (1:04:57)
Well thank you for having me be a part of your journey. I'm honored and I think it's really special what you're doing for our community. So don't stop. It's awesome.

David John Clark (1:05:05)
Thank you.

And likewise, thank you very much. It's been wonderful. Thanks for joining us today, everyone. This is Robert Peterpaul. Check him out on his podcast like I do every week. It's wonderful. Thank you very much.

Robert Peterpaul (1:05:09)
Thank you.

Thank you, good night, good morning, good everything. Good vibes.